Fri. May 27th, 2022

By OEN

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Morgan
Morgan
12 years ago

How is disagreeing with the POTUS equate to “racism”? That Rep. Wilson yelled “you lie!” during Nobama’s speech may have been rude but hardly indicative of racism.

It is the average American hyper-liberal that is racist, constantly referring to Nobama’s race whenever conservatives disagree with him.

I’ve no problem with his race (though I know some do). I, and many other conservatives, have a serious problem with his socialist policies, as well as with the many white, socialist legislators that seem to support them.

Why is it NOT ok to disagree, however strongly, with our current president but it was ok for 8 years to disagree with President Bush by calling him inappropriate names, using disrepectful cartoons, calling him a “liar”, celebrating a movie about his fictional assasination, etc, etc. But disagreeing with Nobama is wrong and indicative of racism…? Please…..get over yourselves, hyper-libs.

RS Janes
12 years ago

To take your comments paragraph by paragraph, Morgan:

“How is disagreeing with the POTUS equate to “racism”? That Rep. Wilson yelled “you lie!” during Nobama’s speech may have been rude but hardly indicative of racism.”

1. I have no problem with people disagreeing with Obama, or any president — I have disagreed with Obama myself. Yes, what Wilson did was rude and had never been done to any other president in recent times, Democrat or Republican, not even to Nixon when he lied about Watergate. Even Republicans disavowed Wilson on his comment. No, it doesn’t prove Wilson’s a racist by itself, but his membership in the Sons of Confederate Veterans, which believes in secession and thinks slavery was no big deal, does.

“It is the average American hyper-liberal that is racist, constantly referring to Nobama’s race whenever conservatives disagree with him.”

2. I’m not sure what you’re getting at, but I don’t recall anyone here at LTS using that to refute all conservative complaints about Obama, just the ones that come from racists like Joe Wilson.

“I’ve no problem with his race (though I know some do). I, and many other conservatives, have a serious problem with his socialist policies, as well as with the many white, socialist legislators that seem to support them.”

3. You cut into the effectiveness of your previous paragraph here — you may have no problem with Obama’s race, but you know some conservatives who do, and they’re the ones I’m talking about. Your mentioning of socialism in connection with Obama’s policies is laughable — Norway is a true socialist democracy — I suggest you read up on what the word means and details of how Norway is run before you call Obama a socialist. You might also reflect on whether you believe your local police force, your local fire department and even the U.S. military are ‘socialist’ organizations. They are all government run, formed for the common good of society and paid for by taxation.

“Why is it NOT ok to disagree, however strongly, with our current president but it was ok for 8 years to disagree with President Bush by calling him inappropriate names, using disrepectful cartoons, calling him a “liar”, celebrating a movie about his fictional assasination, etc, etc. But disagreeing with Nobama is wrong and indicative of racism…? Please…..get over yourselves, hyper-libs.”

4. I’ve already said I don’t think it’s wrong to criticize Obama, just as I saw no problem with criticizing Bush, disrespectful cartoons and the whole ball of wax. That’s free speech. But it was highly inappropriate to yell at the president during a joint session of Congress and that’s one thing no one ever did to Junior Bush. Please, read my posts before you so quickly criticize me as something I’m not or, if you have a problem understanding them, ask someone, perhaps a liberal, for help.

Ken Carman
Admin
12 years ago

I find the baiting that Conservatives do with the supposed curse word “socialist” is laughable.

A. We have never been a purely capitalistic country, or socialistic.

B. So capitalism is pure good and socialism is pure evil? How do you explain shutting off the lights of grandma Millie, the CEOs and mid-level management taking gov money while getting large bonuses and supposed “capitalists” going hat in hand to both Bush and Obama? There is no pure good or evil system, and the wisdom of our system is that it is a mix. The right mix? No, but I suspect it will always need fine tuning… which is, in part, what the health care debate is all about.

3. What would you call a government program that feeds you, clothes you, tells you what to think, where to go? That’s more communistic than socialistic. (There is a difference, as I’m sure you know.) Yet that’s the military. There are somethings the government should do, some things they shouldn’t and are best left to private enterprise… and most, a mix because no one wants companies to be able to sell corrosive acid under the label “baby food.” That is what this discussion is about.

But instead some Cons simply boil this down to nothing more than some simplistic Socialism/ Capitalism battle. No, it’s a discussion about how much, when and where. But it’s always easier to go, “BOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Be very, very afraid,” than have an intelligent, respectful, discussion.

P.S.- Not all of this rant is pointed at the poster. I do tend to go on once I get started.

RS Janes
12 years ago

The Founders of this country, as well as Abraham Lincoln and other presidents, well knew the dangers of untrammeled ‘free market’ capitalism of the kind practiced by our major corporations. Before the 20th century, corporations were chartered state-by-state, limited in scope, and had to prove regularly that what they did was for the common good.

Corporate charters were revoked if the corporation did something — such as selling poisonous products or price fixing — that didn’t serve their customers well. Then the followers of Ayn Rand, Milton Friedman and other ‘neoliberal’ (because they weren’t really classically conservative) economists decided that corporations could be trusted to regulate themselves and should not be hampered by regulation by the government — the people — in any way. That didn’t work in the 1920s — hence the Great Depression — and it didn’t work any better in the Reagan/Bush era. Morgan and his ideological compadres don’t realize it, but the Republicans have had a socialistic government in place for corporations and the privileged since the 1980s — subsidies for Big Oil and energy companies; special tax loopholes for the wealthy; allowing multi-national corporations to pose as US companies while they bank their money overseas, and importing cheap products from other nations at the expense of American jobs, as well as the bailouts and other things you mentioned, Ken. We have had socialism for the upper crust for 30 years now, and it’s been a total and irredeemable failure in every aspect. What we have not had is socialism for the average person, except for Medicare/Medicaid, Social Security, unemployment benefits and in some other marginal ways.

I’m all for the kind of private enterprise that only works when there is a healthy competition between businesses to provide the best service or product at the lowest price. But that’s not in effect in some vital areas of our economy, such as health care, where we have six large for-profit corporations serving most of America with little difference in price; energy, where, again, a few huge corporations control most of the market; municipal utilities, which are generally monopolized by one corporation; media, also mostly dominated by a handful of enormous corporations; retail sales, in those areas where Walmart has driven competition out of business; financial services; banking, and, increasingly, computers, computer peripherals and Internet access.

Wherever a few wealthy corporations dominate the market, there you need the government of We the People to regulate them and keep a close eye on their activities as they have ceased to be a capitalist or free market concern and, inevitably, they will abuse their power at the public’s expense.

Unfortuantely, Fox News viewers and Limbaugh listeners never get this perspective on our economy, and never seem to realize that they are actually hearing the biased opinions of corporations from those outlets, peddling self-serving propaganda.

Fortunately, there is a growing group of ‘Recovering Republicans’ out there — it usually takes the loss of a job, a run-in with a health insurance corporation who has cut them off, or some other drastic event to motivate them to question what has been pumped into them by the corporate media, but it is happening.

Unfortunately, we may have to collapse completely in a slump worse than the Great Depression before enough of them wake up to the harm that has been done to them by hucksters, marketers and cynical corporatists. At that point, you will see the wealthy exiting the country for a safe haven quicker than the Saudi royals left the US after 9/11, and in the same pampered manner.

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